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Climate of Alroth

climate weather equator

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#1 BlakKat

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Posted 08 December 2016 - 11:41 AM

Starting this topic because I think we need to decide where Alroth should be (placement of harvestables, vegetation in general, snow etc) and how its overall climate looks.

So far I worked under the implicit assumption that the DL are about 50 degrees lattitude north of an earth-like planet. Thus, we more humidity in the north-west of mountain ranges and can have snow on top of the mountains.

The trouble with that is that the rest of Alroth will become colder, probably not what we want unless the next continent is just about to be created.

When one looks at the path the sun traces, we see that at noon it seems to come completely vertically, suggesting we are always on the equator ... if we assume a spherical planet for now.

We may come up with an entirely different concept, for instance a disk (or square, or whatever) getting progressively colder or warmer towards the outside.

#2 Grimm

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Posted 08 December 2016 - 12:02 PM

this is a community topic

reference http://www.other-lif...inent-overview/

#3 BlakKat

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Posted 08 December 2016 - 05:23 PM

View PostGrimm, on 08 December 2016 - 12:02 PM, said:

this is a community topic

reference http://www.other-lif...inent-overview/
Can you show me where? I could not find anything specific in the thread. Snow was mentioned once in the beginning as a no-no without any reasoning and climate was only mentioned as something which is important to figure out but then nothing is done about it it seems.

#4 Grimm

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 09:59 AM

Just looking at the geographical layout picture of Alroth,  This is how we are intending to place each map into a world.def. as you stated, may need to think about positioning and type of planet in relation to the sun.   Currently if thinking

View PostBlakKat, on 08 December 2016 - 11:41 AM, said:


So far I worked under the implicit assumption that the DL are about 50 degrees lattitude north of an earth-like planet. Thus, we more humidity in the north-west of mountain ranges and can have snow on top of the mountains.

The trouble with that is that the rest of Alroth will become colder, probably not what we want unless the next continent is just about to be created.


assuming if this is true, then once we decide snow at sea level, most lands north of that will also be snow  I believe this is also why AF is placed far north and its own island to not have a race land completely snow lands.  Instead leaving altitude as the huge factor of snow maps withing the mainlands of Alroth.

as for more detail, only conversation record besides chat log from client was discussed in google docs......  And never updated over to here by those developers.  This is also why we are urging regular updates so we can have reference material all in one site with the game.  Especially when people step away for long periods of time due to real life.

#5 Learner

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 10:02 AM

Keep in mind that weather & altitude can also affect the climate, look at how mild the UK is compared to other countries at the latitude.

#6 Grimm

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 10:06 AM

*n

View PostLearner, on 09 December 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

Keep in mind that weather & altitude can also affect the climate, look at how mild the UK is compared to other countries at the latitude.

agree

#7 BlakKat

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 02:05 PM

The problem is not only with snow, the problem is that DL is a moderate climate, so all you can have going north is moderate climate.

So we may actually want to put the DL south of the equator so that we can get hotter and then colder again when going north.

However, the climate of DL was designed under the assumption that it is north of the equator so that the humidity comes from NW (sorry my bad, but I got that info from somewhere and it fit at the time largely with map descriptions). I did some more research just now and discovered something interesting:
https://geogermanyka...them_winds.jpg. The prevailing winds are not from NW, but from SW, however: the humidity comes in Europe clearly from the NW probably because of the warm water upwelling in the north atlantic. So, I speculate that in other regions of the earth this may be different. Thus, I think placing DL south of the equator is actually fine.

So ideas I have at this time:

1) Put the DL south of the equator. Since most ppl are from the nothern hemisphere they may feel slightly confused, but I doubt it is noticeable.

2) A radical idea would be to leave it N of the equator but expand the continent to the south rather than to the north. Not sure what issues that would cause.

3) Have lots of vulcanic activity in the center of the continent to warm us up

4) Ditch the idea of a spherical planet.

My ranking would be #1,#4,#3,#2.
BTW: what would be wrong with a race living mostly in snowlands other than butler and makiltur disliked it for some unknown reason. The orcs may actually thrive well there ...

#8 Grimm

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 07:04 PM

No problem with a whole race being a snow land, just not everything but humans and dwarfs,

if you look at this
Attached File  CL_Comparison.png   1.05MB   15 downloads

remember that it was created as a base and CL's are not accurate, was suggested ie Dwarven Lands are higher CL than proposed.  Please stay on topic and don't turn this into CL convo.

But I would propose map labeled 31, 33 be the hottest since they are intended to be desert rocky areas in which high level monsters and not owned by races.

as you currently see RI was moved, But also thinking that Anaith Fallora be placed farthest from the sun,,,
as for an equator if we have one,,,,,  I not sure, but we can include wind direction, fronts and altitude to map and explain the environment.

Keep in mind future development.  We could have seasons in which we utilize map changes, migration, and maybe even natural disasters which can permanently change a map, even create and watch natives rebuild.

#9 BlakKat

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Posted 09 December 2016 - 10:20 PM

Looking at the map placing DL south of the equator would work. Also if we want to get the seasons work, we should get south and north to allow for migration.
Taking wind and altitude into consideration is not that hard. Apart from maps 45and 46, it would work imho.

#10 BlakKat

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Posted 10 December 2016 - 10:20 AM

View PostBlakKat, on 09 December 2016 - 10:20 PM, said:

Looking at the map placing DL south of the equator would work. Also if we want to get the seasons work, we should get south and north to allow for migration.
Taking wind and altitude into consideration is not that hard. Apart from maps 45and 46, it would work imho.
I take the last reservation back: the colors in that map in no way signify humidity. So we are totally free I think to assign temperature and humidity to the various maps.

#11 BlakKat

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 11:48 PM

Ok, here is a draft of what the climate could look like: https://docs.google....lQQ1GOtPxM/edit

Edit: added link to dev-site: http://docs.other-li...consistency.pdf

Don't know how to upload images, so if you know, please tell me.

#12 Kiwi06

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Posted 12 December 2016 - 03:04 AM

Just my two cents here...

I look at the island-continent of Alroth as a moderate climate similar to Pacific Islands. I imagined quite a bit of oceanic-volcanic activity around Alroth. If you look at volcanic areas of Earth, you might get an idea of what I mean. These occur in open ocean with island land landmass creating a "ring of fire" type geography. This is what I imagined for Alroth. AF wouldn't be farfetched in that regard - it could easily be placed NW of Alroth if Alroth is in the Northern Hemisphere. This fits with planned story as well.

Also think about this concept... You are trying so hard to apply real life circumstances to a fantastical world. Would Seridia, or even mainstream games match up to those standards? I think you might be over thinking all of this tbh

#13 BlakKat

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Posted 12 December 2016 - 08:49 AM

View PostKiwi06, on 12 December 2016 - 03:04 AM, said:

Just my two cents here...

I look at the island-continent of Alroth as a moderate climate similar to Pacific Islands. I imagined quite a bit of oceanic-volcanic activity around Alroth. If you look at volcanic areas of Earth, you might get an idea of what I mean. These occur in open ocean with island land landmass creating a "ring of fire" type geography. This is what I imagined for Alroth. AF wouldn't be farfetched in that regard - it could easily be placed NW of Alroth if Alroth is in the Northern Hemisphere. This fits with planned story as well.

Also think about this concept... You are trying so hard to apply real life circumstances to a fantastical world. Would Seridia, or even mainstream games match up to those standards? I think you might be over thinking all of this tbh

It is unclear to me what you mean with moderate climate. Depending on your definition of Pacific Islands, it goes from tropical all the way to polar.

I do not care about the standards of other games ... but vulcanic activity is pretty independent of climate unless it is so strong that it creates its own climate, so adding it is pretty straightforward.

BTW: happy to have fewer (or even next to no) climate zones, but I thought we wanted to have variation. Would be a shame to have no palm trees and nice beaches on Alroth.

#14 Kiwi06

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 12:31 AM

Think North Africa/Spain type area, except its own Island-continent.

As soon as you put palm trees it's very tropical and rules out other climate zones. Same with snow. This is why I argue for a less strict portrayal of realistic climate zones and opt for a more quickly flowing geographic area. We go from hot dry basin to tall cold mountain tops very quick in the Dwarven Lands, for example. These areas indeed aren't very realistic, yet we don't really want to see 11 snow maps or 11 desert maps, do we?

#15 Learner

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 01:22 AM

Hawaii goes from Tropic to skiing on the same island during the Winter. Elevation does allow for that combination easily.

But I agree we don't want too many snow maps ... we can always add another continent/landmass later thats heavy on snow if desired.

#16 BlakKat

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 02:04 AM

Ok, I see, DL does look quite a bit colder to me though, except Braigor/Morog which have no vegetation to speak of to indicate a climate.

What you see in the DL is realistic. I have been skiing in good powder one day and windsurfing the next day just 30km away in warm weather. If it is dry, the air gets about 1 degree colder going up 100 m in elevation, if it is humid less because of the increased heat capacity as well as latent heat from condensation. So if you go up 2000 m, we are talking 20 degrees C on a clear day. That is why you see no complaints from me that TM is covered in snow (it tends to be overall colder when there is precipitation), but you need to go high up to get that effect. On the equator, we are talking 4000 m to get proper snow.

But tbh I totally have no idea what the actual issue is at this point. For instance, the climate zones I laid out allow for that variation from tropical to moderate (at sea level) and even polar for AF if you place it either very far north or just a bit south. If we go with a unified climate zone, then we won't get tropical climates as the DL are mostly at sea level.

#17 Kiwi06

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 04:43 AM

Plan was to have AF far NW. On a map it would look closer (see USA - Alaska).

#18 Makiltur

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Posted 28 April 2017 - 01:33 PM

I'm back-ish! Placement of RI and AF and any outlying islands were essentially just placeholders at the time, I can drag those polygons wherever. Butler and I did only a basic rundown of climate but I'd be happy to expand on our ideas if that would help.
I'll try to get back into ArcGIS and make some updates with whatever I can find.

#19 DueCE

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 06:09 PM

View PostMakiltur, on 28 April 2017 - 01:33 PM, said:

I'm back-ish! Placement of RI and AF and any outlying islands were essentially just placeholders at the time, I can drag those polygons wherever. Butler and I did only a basic rundown of climate but I'd be happy to expand on our ideas if that would help.
I'll try to get back into ArcGIS and make some updates with whatever I can find.

holy cow, sorry to be off topic but hi maki and welcome back :)

#20 Learner

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 06:32 PM

View PostDueCE, on 29 April 2017 - 06:09 PM, said:

View PostMakiltur, on 28 April 2017 - 01:33 PM, said:

I'm back-ish! Placement of RI and AF and any outlying islands were essentially just placeholders at the time, I can drag those polygons wherever. Butler and I did only a basic rundown of climate but I'd be happy to expand on our ideas if that would help.
I'll try to get back into ArcGIS and make some updates with whatever I can find.

holy cow, sorry to be off topic but hi maki and welcome back :)
She was actually back in game as well, not just forums.




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