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Increase the chance to find stone cape


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#1 Ashitaka

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 08:19 PM

Having a cape the increase chance of stone when harvesting instead to use excavator cape. I think it could be nice to have one in game ;)

#2 CoduX

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 09:47 PM

Instead of a cape since I think that would be a bit OP, how about an item that gives a brief duration?
How about a scroll that lasts for 1 hour or a potion that lasts for 1 hour with a % base chance increase...even a knowledge book (that I would recommend being very experience), that gives a permanent %+ chance of finding would be cool.

Sorry but i think a cape is just too OP

#3 Kaddy

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 10:19 PM

I also think that having rare things very rare is rather stupid as it forces people to hoard

#4 ebattleon

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 04:17 AM

You could make a cape that was balanced call it lucky finder. The cape would give a benefit along that of the Artificer's but only that, no brake from events, no speed boost.

#5 butler

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Posted 15 May 2017 - 04:41 AM

Cape means you choose either x2 harvested things, or an increased rate of finding. You could always have another cape which instead of for every harvest (like exca) giving you 2 (meaning one harvest instance), you just double the speed of each individual harvesting instance (like the difference between say, harvesting imaptiens to harvesting iron). And afaik, your chance of a rare stone is based off the individual instances, meaning your exca has no effect on it.

I agree with Kaddy, artificial rarity causes hording. In the real world, it inspires scalpers, and the only reason such practices happen is to give it a feel of value. In a game the finished product (if it's at the highest level) should have a feeling of achievable value, something realistic, but still with that tinge of rarity around it's edges. My favoured way of rectifying this would be to change mixing so that your raw resources have to be processed a number of times to get to the best quality, as well as letting you augment the mixing process to give slight stat variations depending on material.

That's a little bit of a tangent, you might be able to incorporate the first part into an idea for a cape, but there needs to be balance. My main issue with a scroll is that allows them to also use an exca, so they get a two-fold harvesting bonus. But again, the scroll has the advantage of limiting things.

I think this thread of thought needs more development. I like the core thoughts

#6 Ashitaka

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 07:20 AM

if you think a cape is to OP,  why not an enhanced pickaxe that increase chance to find stone when using it ? It could have also a little less chance to break than a normal pickaxe.

and if they could be made by crafter would be very nice too.

#7 WaterBottle

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 08:41 AM

I agree overall that the current rate of finding a rare stone find are too low. With the pickaxe idea I would want it to have a greater chance of breaking if it's going to increase the chances, for balance purposes.

The break rate would depend on:
- If it will be makeable
- The ings required for making it

If it's relatively low cost to make, I would want the break rate higher than if it's a high cost to make. I wouldn't want this pickaxe to be ultra rare either (e.g. rare drop only), since then we're just shifting the rarity problem instead of addressing it as originally intended even though we introduced something.

#8 Learner

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 08:48 AM

Keep in mind that one of the main factors in finding stones is also the % chance of any event (like walls falling on you). Finding a stone is just one of the possible options under that. It doesn't even attempt tp segregate god vs bad events at all, it simply attempts to select one of them.

#9 WaterBottle

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 09:22 AM

Then the flow is: every harvest has a chance to trigger an event... if an event is triggered choose what that event is... each event has certain % be chosen?

So from a code perspective, our discussion is revolving around adjusting the rate that, when an event is triggered, the event is a rare stone find (and the break event for the pickaxe idea)?

#10 Learner

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 09:41 AM

View PostWaterBottle, on 16 May 2017 - 09:22 AM, said:

Then the flow is: every harvest has a chance to trigger an event... if an event is triggered choose what that event is... each event has certain % be chosen?

So from a code perspective, our discussion is revolving around adjusting the rate that, when an event is triggered, the event is a rare stone find (and the break event for the pickaxe idea)?
Due to how things are coded currently it's actually more complicated, since a random number is generated and the result is looked up to see what gets triggered, and when that fails then a % chance is run for Removal stones. There isn't a simple place to change the % chance for things like Serpent or Binding due to how that lookup works. The number rolled to look up in that chart is also 1 - 100 currently so there isn't a lot of room for fine tuning since for the rare things change by 1% is a huge change compared to what the current chances are,

Better to do a complete rewrite there, which right now I think is a much lower priority. This is a case of an idea that sounds simple at this time is actually alot more complicated then it sounds.

#11 Ashitaka

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 09:48 AM

View PostWaterBottle, on 16 May 2017 - 09:22 AM, said:

Then the flow is: every harvest has a chance to trigger an event... if an event is triggered choose what that event is... each event has certain % be chosen?

So from a code perspective, our discussion is revolving around adjusting the rate that, when an event is triggered, the event is a rare stone find (and the break event for the pickaxe idea)?

i would like them makeble, not saying they should be easy to make, but adding new items must be a priority too, i think all items in game should be made. even stone :P

give more jobs for manuer, crafter, potioner :P
more variety is fun.

But yes the pickaxe could increase a lot the chance to get a stone and it break after the stone is found.

View PostLearner, on 16 May 2017 - 09:41 AM, said:

View PostWaterBottle, on 16 May 2017 - 09:22 AM, said:

Then the flow is: every harvest has a chance to trigger an event... if an event is triggered choose what that event is... each event has certain % be chosen?

So from a code perspective, our discussion is revolving around adjusting the rate that, when an event is triggered, the event is a rare stone find (and the break event for the pickaxe idea)?
Due to how things are coded currently it's actually more complicated, since a random number is generated and the result is looked up to see what gets triggered, and when that fails then a % chance is run for Removal stones. There isn't a simple place to change the % chance for things like Serpent or Binding due to how that lookup works. The number rolled to look up in that chart is also 1 - 100 currently so there isn't a lot of room for fine tuning since for the rare things change by 1% is a huge change compared to what the current chances are,

Better to do a complete rewrite there, which right now I think is a much lower priority. This is a case of an idea that sounds simple at this time is actually alot more complicated then it sounds.

Could it be possible to add a code for the pickaxe to have an pourcentage in any event to give a chance to get an stone.

Like you have don't know the % but if you have 5% for an event everytime you harvest, at every event we get the pickaxe give an extra chance to get a stone regarless of the event. and the pickaxe poof if we get a stone this way. so we have the normal chance from harvesting event and extra from pickaxe.

#12 Learner

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 09:49 AM

View PostLearner, on 16 May 2017 - 09:41 AM, said:

View PostWaterBottle, on 16 May 2017 - 09:22 AM, said:

Then the flow is: every harvest has a chance to trigger an event... if an event is triggered choose what that event is... each event has certain % be chosen?

So from a code perspective, our discussion is revolving around adjusting the rate that, when an event is triggered, the event is a rare stone find (and the break event for the pickaxe idea)?
Due to how things are coded currently it's actually more complicated, since a random number is generated and the result is looked up to see what gets triggered, and when that fails then a % chance is run for Removal stones. There isn't a simple place to change the % chance for things like Serpent or Binding due to how that lookup works. The number rolled to look up in that chart is also 1 - 100 currently so there isn't a lot of room for fine tuning since for the rare things change by 1% is a huge change compared to what the current chances are,

Better to do a complete rewrite there, which right now I think is a much lower priority. This is a case of an idea that sounds simple at this time is actually alot more complicated then it sounds.
Looking at the code more, there is an additional % chance check in Serpent, Enrichment & Binding stones that could be tunable. That % chance there allows you to just stop without ever getting anything, so some of the 'stop but no results' may turn into stones instead.

#13 Learner

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 09:56 AM

View PostAshitaka, on 16 May 2017 - 09:48 AM, said:

Could it be possible to add a code for the pickaxe to have an pourcentage in any event to give a chance to get an stone.

Like you have don't know the % but if you have 5% for an event everytime you harvest, at every event we get the pickaxe give an extra chance to get a stone regarless of the event. and the pickaxe poof if we get a stone this way. so we have the normal chance from harvesting event and extra from pickaxe.

:ebul: Add that to the Titanium Pickaxe instead of makeable!

#14 Learner

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 04:22 PM

View PostLearner, on 16 May 2017 - 09:56 AM, said:

View PostAshitaka, on 16 May 2017 - 09:48 AM, said:

Could it be possible to add a code for the pickaxe to have an pourcentage in any event to give a chance to get an stone.

Like you have don't know the % but if you have 5% for an event everytime you harvest, at every event we get the pickaxe give an extra chance to get a stone regarless of the event. and the pickaxe poof if we get a stone this way. so we have the normal chance from harvesting event and extra from pickaxe.

:ebul: Add that to the Titanium Pickaxe instead of makeable!
... and then wear a Harvester Medallion to reduce the risk of the Titanium Pickaxe from breaking to improve your chances of getting a stone before the pick breaks ... which is something people have not been doing to protect their costly Titanium Picks

#15 Ashitaka

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 08:03 PM

yup with those chance it would be great and help a lot ;)

#16 WaterBottle

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 08:20 AM

Yeah sounds like you got this now. :P

#17 Learner

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 08:39 AM

My concern is people will think that the TPick price may be to high to risk (but would help pull dome GC from the game), and may not think it's worthwhile to use a HarvMed with to lower the break rate. But on the other hand that does help get more GC while harvesting.

On the plus side, we're not adding a new item, and people harvesting Seridium for Gather/HarvMeds automatically get a higher chance for stones as well since that requires the TPick.

Next would come trying to think about what a reasonable increase would be.would have to be tested in small steps, and that would take a lot of harvesting to see if people even notice the difference.

I did go ahead and throw this together quickly on Test, with a value of '+5' that should have about a 50% increase (if you got 10 on Main, that means on Test you should get about 15). Remember this only affects Serpent Stones, Enrichment Stones, & Binding Stones. How it works means a few less where you just stop harvesting, and instead you get a stone.

#18 WaterBottle

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 10:22 AM

I'll definitely chip in with testing. Is the adjustment for when using a Tpick?

#19 Learner

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 10:57 AM

View PostWaterBottle, on 17 May 2017 - 10:22 AM, said:

I'll definitely chip in with testing. Is the adjustment for when using a Tpick?
The adjustment takes place anytime you are harvesting using a TPick.

#20 WaterBottle

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 12:38 PM

Can we make Tpicks temporarily free on test as we gather data on stones and breakages? :P




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