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separate nexus points from PP, fighting AND other skills


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#21 EatsAllLife

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Posted 11 June 2017 - 11:02 PM

View Postbutler, on 10 June 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

View PostEatsAllLife, on 10 June 2017 - 10:44 AM, said:

View Postbutler, on 10 June 2017 - 03:34 AM, said:

Think an all rounder build that does sacrifice some combat proficiency is fine, as that's a specialisation that you have chosen to do at a disadvantage to you. However, if you can just do every skill excessively well, then there is no point of having the system as a whole. We should have the game going towards being more strategic.

Also Eats, we aren't all writing off the idea as bad... a number of us just saw possible issues and decided to give critique and thoughts. Things aren't absolute.

Then it makes the game a class system, not a 'classless system'. You'd be removing one of the most favorable things in OL/EL. Personally, I think this would make more people leave. You cannot do each skill excessively well as an allrounder, you can do them, but not to the full potential. Mixers typically take carry and ratio for max load/exp and 25 PP, along with some matter to withstand harvest dmg. . Fighters take 4 attribs, over time adding more, and 4 nexus, along with some matter..Allrounders take a variation of everything, ratio for magic/exp, cary for more per load, fighting attributes, along with the 25 nexus... We cannot do a single skill as well as a defined person that chooses fighting, mixing, or magic... Don't limit anyone more!
~Eats

Classless is being able to modify and not be restrained to a set class, however you do create economic issues when you make perfect one man machines. There needs to be a way for those specialising in a singular or limited number of skills to be able to out do an all rounder. An all rounders advantage should be their ability to make good versions of everything, a specialist should be able to make excellent versions of less things. I believe a (very) old suggestion by hades of attaching sub levels to individual items (such as when makign a certain item or fighting with a certain item) that you should become more proficient at it. I would also say that you should also have a small roll when making the items, and have that roll be a bit more favourable to specialists.

I am also not suggesting removing it completely. I am suggesting we overhaul the system so it actually works and is considered. A lot of what we have in OL is just an amalgamation of mostly unconnected content, partially from inheritance of EL, partially from not actually aiming to look at a larger macro scale. I miss rabbitman, he was fairly good at a number of these things, especially the numbers, where I fail.

Do think it's worth looking at the system and saying we can do better, and we can expand on the xattris. We can expand the mechanics so people can choose how much they want to specialise with each individual piece, or not if they so choose, but we need to balance them in terms of what they can do, and have the trade off a bit more considered.

also with the original thing, human nexus could be replaced simply by using the a/d/combat level as a guide for when you can wear certain items, or even oa.

Nexus as a whole probably needs some sort of replacement, maybe not so forceful, due to the ease of getting a number of skills up to fairly powerful levels atm (only reason I'm not steaming ahead in potioning or summoning is because i can't afford the nexus), so we definitely need something to help us actually think about specialising rather than at higher levels just going fuck it, I have the cash, lets get it all up (which isn't really that well mitigated atm, at would be worse without, and not great economically increasing hording and reducing interaction.) I argued it before, we need the mixing system fixed and thought through, we need to have it encourage interaction, and we need it to be more of choice in line with how people choose between various fighting builds. The current mixing system isn't quite fit for purpose, but in a lot of ways the bare minimum that could be done for the inclusion of one.

I see what you're saying, but so  Hell some allrounders don't even take some nexus due to the fact of it being so damaging on things and some are unneccesary for certain people. Such as summoning, or the arti human nexus. See,  build doesn't use carry, because I find it useless to me, and it would damage more than helping. Where some don't take ratio because they don't need the extra exp, and prefer the higher carry load. It deters my gameplay by making more trips and all. I feel making people select the nexus for a select few skills, is making them choose a class. Making it somewhat a class system, if that makes sense. I can see where you're coming from with the "perfect player" aspect, but I honestly in no way see my player as perfect. There's mixers that best my mixing levels by a lot, fighters that can obliterate my fighting skills away, and mages that suck the life outta me, compared to my life drain. I may do ALL skills, but they are weaker than a defined player. That's our sacrifice. So I don't see the big deal. We're weaker, but can do more. But really, all builds can do mixing if they choose, a fighter can be 95% fighter, and spend 4 more PP into some vegetal and mix what they need. Along with 2 in inorganic for harvesting it. Then they can do all their mixing. They can make their SR's, BR's, and HE... They'd only need other players for dis rings. Throw 3 more into magic, and they have most of their work cut out for them, besides iron gear, and serp. But if they kill enough to get the serp stone drop, and mix enough FE to get the 5 EFE. Their work is all cut out for them... Mixers can fight, yeah, not the highest monsters, but it is possible. Mages, hell yeah they can. I've Life Drain killed so many higher end bosses, such as troll night, cyce, etc. An allrounder may be able to do it all, but not as well!
~Eats

#22 butler

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Posted 12 June 2017 - 04:16 PM

Eats, you may be missing my point of maybe looking at the system and trying to do a thoughtful balancing rather than a makeshift let's see if it works as i go along ,ethod(or what I'd like to call, the radu's design process).

I think it's at least worth looking at the system as a whole, including nexus, looking at xattris and the perks, and moving them around somewhat to make it a clever system that promotes strategy on purpose rather than slightly haphazardly




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