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Using Attribute Removal Stones below 4


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#1 CoduX

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Posted 06 January 2021 - 06:32 AM

Hi,

An initial quick lesson for those that do not know how Attribute Removal Stones work. An Attribute Removal Stone removes 1 pickpoint off your chosen attribute that you have previously allocated so you can re-distribute that 1 pickpoint to another Attribute ort Nexus.

Currently there is (what I believe) to be a hidden influx of Attribute Removal Stones sitting in players storages not being used. Obviously we can use them to take away pickpoints we have allocated to re-distribute to another Attribute or Nexus. Currently the base of any Attribute is 4.

I am curious to see what others player's opinions are (if it is even possible to do) if we can go further on the Cross-Attribute removal and use one of these stones to make the base attribute lower than 4. For example if your Perception is at base 4 and you used a Perception Removal Stone, it would lower to 3 and let you gain 1 pickpoint.

I'm not sure if this is even possible or if it is hard-coded from EL that you can't go lower than 4. Initial thoughts?

#2 EatsAllLife

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Posted 06 January 2021 - 07:36 AM

View PostCoduX, on 06 January 2021 - 06:32 AM, said:

Hi,

An initial quick lesson for those that do not know how Attribute Removal Stones work. An Attribute Removal Stone removes 1 pickpoint off your chosen attribute that you have previously allocated so you can re-distribute that 1 pickpoint to another Attribute ort Nexus.

Currently there is (what I believe) to be a hidden influx of Attribute Removal Stones sitting in players storages not being used. Obviously we can use them to take away pickpoints we have allocated to re-distribute to another Attribute or Nexus. Currently the base of any Attribute is 4.

I am curious to see what others player's opinions are (if it is even possible to do) if we can go further on the Cross-Attribute removal and use one of these stones to make the base attribute lower than 4. For example if your Perception is at base 4 and you used a Perception Removal Stone, it would lower to 3 and let you gain 1 pickpoint.

I'm not sure if this is even possible or if it is hard-coded from EL that you can't go lower than 4. Initial thoughts?

I have thought this many times but never voiced it. I feel it'd be a great system, but I don't think the server could understand a 0 for an attribute (without tweaking anyways). In Eternal lands, as we know the pick points worked in pairs, which is why I feel the base was 4. Perhaps we could lower it to 2 here as we wouldn't need that 'pairing' if the 0 is not an option.

I don't really see a downside of this either, as if you removed the base 4 of un-needed nexus from ANY build, would give roughly 32 extra PP. Not even another full attribute maxing.

~Eats

#3 Learner

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Posted 06 January 2021 - 05:14 PM

Since the first 4 are freebies, either they shouldn't be removable OR they get subtracted from you PP when you're created or reset!

#4 CoduX

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Posted 06 January 2021 - 05:21 PM

View PostLearner, on 06 January 2021 - 05:14 PM, said:

Since the first 4 are freebies, either they shouldn't be removable OR they get subtracted from you PP when you're created or reset!
What is the reason why you wouldn't be able to remove them with a stone when you just said that an option would be to remove them by a different means? My most recent response was if they would be allowed to be removed they would cost PP's instead of being free?

#5 Learner

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Posted 06 January 2021 - 06:15 PM

View PostCoduX, on 06 January 2021 - 05:21 PM, said:

View PostLearner, on 06 January 2021 - 05:14 PM, said:

Since the first 4 are freebies, either they shouldn't be removable OR they get subtracted from you PP when you're created or reset!
What is the reason why you wouldn't be able to remove them with a stone when you just said that an option would be to remove them by a different means?
While my attitude may change overtime, where did I say the first four could be removable? I don't ever recall saying anything like that, so I suspect what I said was taken out of context.After all, I said if going below 4 would be allowed, it would have to cost you from your initial PP's. so no 'free PP' are available!

#6 EatsAllLife

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Posted 10 January 2021 - 04:18 AM

View PostLearner, on 06 January 2021 - 06:15 PM, said:

View PostCoduX, on 06 January 2021 - 05:21 PM, said:

View PostLearner, on 06 January 2021 - 05:14 PM, said:

Since the first 4 are freebies, either they shouldn't be removable OR they get subtracted from you PP when you're created or reset!
What is the reason why you wouldn't be able to remove them with a stone when you just said that an option would be to remove them by a different means?
While my attitude may change overtime, where did I say the first four could be removable? I don't ever recall saying anything like that, so I suspect what I said was taken out of context.After all, I said if going below 4 would be allowed, it would have to cost you from your initial PP's. so no 'free PP' are available!

I see no issue with these 'free PP' anyways. You're ultimately weakening your original set of skills to further enhance other areas, these require removals to use- which getting one removal stone of a kind is a pain enough, let alone 32 individual removal stones. Currently, removals are almost useless unless someone happens to make a mistake when doing a soft reset. (which, coincidentally is the reason by which they are useless). The soft-resets would also not allow you to 're-arrange' those base attributes. So, if you were to switch builds- you'd need to get the removals again in order to utilize those extra stored PP. It's an easy way to keep the removal stones relevant, worth money- which could open a whole new category of the economy over time, and prevent this from being abused as a method to be an OP all-rounder like all of EL.
Trust me, none of us want everyone to be able to do everything- that removes the necessity for specialized builds in scenarios. But what is 32 PP more going to harm, it's not like we're opening up buying nexus to be removed...




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