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#1 Meneldor

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 03:41 PM

Here you can whine about this skill :P.

I'll be the first :D.

Water essence - 1 sapph, 1 blue quartz, 1 blue lupine, 1 bsf
Imo this formula is too complex for that lvl and xp you get, ony 10 xp but you need sapph (ino 4 and harv 35) or give it a lot more xp or exclude sapph from formula, that way it would be made more and would be in boundaries of lvl and xp.

Earth Essence - no use, suggestions?

Air, Spirit, Matter, Energy Essence - same as water essence, formulas are complex and should give more xp.

I gave my opinion and am expecting pthers too :D.

#2 CoduX

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:12 AM

Yes, water essence requires sapphires to make, for something that low lvled requiring such a (higher tier?) harvestable sounds a bit ridiculous.
For the Earth Essence..just leave it for now..it could be used in the future.
As for the others you mentioned..just leave the ings, but increase the xp per essence make slightly

But good suggestion.

#3 PandemiC

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:12 AM

I don't agree at all. When mixing exp was changed and formula's were created, you used to get 1.5-2x more exp (from their current) for almost everything. (basically Rec_Lvl*Rec_Lvl)

Seemed a little OP.

Now;
The formulae doesn't take into calculation WHAT item it is being used in the mixing proccess i.e. Diamond/Sapphire, just simply if it uses 1/2/3/4/5 ingredients and requires a tool, and dependant on the rec. lvl. (if I remember correctly). (Hence huge increase from SRs/BRs/PoF in potion)

I don't agree that there are any issues with Alchemy exp given from items. The amount of exp you already get (without poofing anything in school) has got me to 58~ alch. Making everything from FE to ME to Titanium Bars... There are things that you make for EXP, Things you make for GC, Things you make for Enriched Essences, some cater all 3 of those (like Magic Ess) so regardless of their current recommended levels here are my reasons;

Water Essence - The only people that use water essence are crafters (which it is virtually necessary that you have inorg 4 to harvest all the gems anyway).
Energy Essence - Silver and Iron ore too complex? these are the two easiest ores to get (except Learners huge stash of titanium).
Air Essence - Use? Magic - yet to be reworked
Spirit - Probably the only one I'll agree on till we get alembics + cinnabar.
Matter Essence - Use? Magic - Yet to be reworked also, Iron and quartz are pretty simple to get ahold of aswell, books costing <5k.

#4 Learner

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 05:22 AM

Since Harvesting the Sapphires etc is where it's hard, you get harvesting exp for hard to harvest items. I do see this driving up the final price for WE, but not a factor in how much exp WE should give. If we really wanted to raise the exp for the essences to give, you should raised the rec level for making them.

P.S. It's not a stash, I'm preparing to make a lot of bars shortly. Gathering the other ing's I need now.

#5 themuntdregger

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 06:32 AM

View PostMeneldor, on 28 January 2013 - 03:41 PM, said:

Here you can whine about this skill :P.

I'll be the first :D.

Water essence - 1 sapph, 1 blue quartz, 1 blue lupine, 1 bsf
Imo this formula is too complex for that lvl and xp you get, ony 10 xp but you need sapph (ino 4 and harv 35) or give it a lot more xp or exclude sapph from formula, that way it would be made more and would be in boundaries of lvl and xp.

Earth Essence - no use, suggestions?

Air, Spirit, Matter, Energy Essence - same as water essence, formulas are complex and should give more xp.

I gave my opinion and am expecting pthers too :D.

I'll admit i've sometimes wondered why water essence doesn't have a higher nexus requirement, but I don't see that as a particular reason to whine.

Neither do I personally see the amount of exp as being a significant problem, unless you're seriously intending to power level by mixing water essence ???

As for the formula being too complex, does this reflect the number of ings, or the supposed difficulty in obtaining sapphires ???

If the only option for obtaining sapphires was to laboriously obtain and purchase all the books required to harv them, then i'd agree. However, as the item is available from an npc, I fail to see where the difficulty lies. Doesn't mean that a 'difficulty' doesn't exist, or that you're not entitled to your opinion, simply that your argument fails to make much of a case.

#6 PandemiC

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 09:09 AM

View PostLearner, on 29 January 2013 - 05:22 AM, said:

P.S. It's not a stash, I'm preparing to make a lot of bars shortly. Gathering the other ing's I need now.

Then to make an Army of Titanium Ants? Plotting to take over... ?

#7 Learner

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 09:17 AM

No, just to arm them with T!

#8 Meneldor

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:08 AM

Geez, can no one understand problem i'm stating? Do you need everything written step by step?
I'll do that.

@Pandemic
You said you make things that give you gc, xp or enriched. WE's are nothing like that, you can get 4-5 gc per WE, no way FE's are way easier, xp is only 12 with rationality 4 as default FE's are better, you can get EWE, what will you do with it when you can get EFE.
Point: they are useless in any possible way. Only crafters needs them, but they are pain in the ass to make so you can lvl crafting.
Conclusion: maybe munt is right, NPC sells them, lower his price to 5 gc and EOD.

#9 themuntdregger

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 12:59 PM

View PostMeneldor, on 29 January 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

Conclusion: maybe munt is right, NPC sells them, lower his price to 5 gc and EOD.

Not sure that lowering the NPC sale price is necessarily a good idea.

Those players who rely on selling w/e's will tend to be less well established players. If you reduce the NPC sale price, less players are likely to be inclined to spend time making them.

If you believe in a player run economy, either NPC prices need to be set ridiculously high, or the sale of mixable items by NPC's needs to be removed entirely.

#10 PandemiC

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:38 AM

View PostMeneldor, on 29 January 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

Geez, can no one understand problem i'm stating? Do you need everything written step by step?
I'll do that.

@Pandemic
You said you make things that give you gc, xp or enriched. WE's are nothing like that, you can get 4-5 gc per WE, no way FE's are way easier, xp is only 12 with rationality 4 as default FE's are better, you can get EWE, what will you do with it when you can get EFE.
Point: they are useless in any possible way. Only crafters needs them, but they are pain in the ass to make so you can lvl crafting.
Conclusion: maybe munt is right, NPC sells them, lower his price to 5 gc and EOD.

Lower the price to 5gc? You just turned your whole argument upside down. Yeah go make the price 5gc and lets see who actually bothers to mix them, ever, seen as they don't bother now? I don't follow.


EDIT: Also your arrogance is rather annoying.

Edited by PandemiC, 30 January 2013 - 03:38 AM.


#11 Dilly

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:34 AM

I think (or hope..) what Meneldor was trying to say is that, for the fact that WE are a 'lowlevel' alchemy item, the prequisite to being able to gather all ingredients yourself are rather steep. It's true that sapphs are a bit more advanced when it comes to harvesting, but at the same time I think the crafting skill isn't necessarily a skill that someone who starts out in OL without any previous experience would level at first (how on earth would they be able to afford the sandingpapers?), so by the time you'd actually get to the point where you'd need mass amounts of them, you would have obtained the needed harv level and nexus already.

Either way, no need to make them harder or easier to make, they're fine as they are, nothing wrong with having to overcome some obstacles sometimes, and if you're really not bothered with doing so, then pay up and get them from NPC for exactly the price they already are.

#12 Learner

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:37 AM

Plus, Harvesting is it's own Skill, so the harvest level for an item should not affect the level or experience in another skill just for that reason.

#13 PandemiC

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:54 AM

Thanks Dilly, you got across what I was trying to say XD




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